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Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: gsmurphy (IP Logged)
Date: September 1, 2006 06:19PM
Category: Sails and canvas

I am planning to cruise the Sea of Cortez and West Coast of Mexico. My jib is about 110% and roller reefing. It is a great all round cruising sail but underperforms in light air, especially downwind. So, I am considering an assymetrical spinnaker or drifter. Destarte' is a CCY built boat with about a 37 foot rig (slightly longer than the SBM built boats I think).

1. Does anyone know the best measurements for asymetrical spinnakers or drifters for a BCC?

2. Any thoughts on the style of cut?

3. Can a drifter be used effectively without hanking it to the headstay, using the shackle at the bowsprit tip and a spin halyard?

Thanks,
Jerry Murphy
s/v Destarte'

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: Ron Thompson (IP Logged)
Date: September 1, 2006 09:04PM
Category: Sails and canvas

I had a drifter/reacher made by Lee Sails in Hong Kong. I gave them the standard dimensions for a reacher for the BCC.
Luff 36'11"
Leach 33'03"
Foot 25'08"
That gives you about 462 sq. ft.
It has worked well for me in light winds up to 15 kts and apparant wind angle of 60 degrees to 120 degrees.
Ron Thompson
Ho'okahiko #97

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: gsmurphy (IP Logged)
Date: September 5, 2006 05:39PM
Category: Sails and canvas

Thanks, Ron.

Jerry

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: bccodyssey (IP Logged)
Date: March 26, 2010 02:59AM
Category: Sails and canvas

Hi Ron,
I have the BCC Odyssey and I am interested in getting a sail that will keep me moving in light airs. I noticed the post below in the forum from a couple of years ago. You sounded pretty happy with the Lee sail. Is that still the case? Where did you get the dimensions? I am guessing these would be standard for all BCCs. Any insight you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
Wayne Edney
BCC Odyssey




I had a drifter/reacher made by Lee Sails in Hong Kong. I gave them the standard dimensions for a reacher for the BCC.
Luff 36'11"
Leach 33'03"
Foot 25'08"
That gives you about 462 sq. ft.
It has worked well for me in light winds up to 15 kts and apparant wind angle of 60 degrees to 120 degrees.
Ron Thompson
Ho'okahiko #97

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: Ron Thompson (IP Logged)
Date: March 26, 2010 05:06AM
Category: Sails and canvas

Hi Wayne,

I am still happy with my drifter/reacher. It has performed well and I have no complaints with the sail at all. It is a big impressive sail that is fun to use. The sock that came with it has also done well and was pretty cheap compared to others. The dimensions came from the BCC sailplan. I had them make it to those specs. I installed a ring bolt to one side in the cranse iron to run a block from so I can adjust the tack from the cockpit. It would be better if it was forward of the headstay but it works. I run the sheet from a snatch block on the bulwark. Setting it all up to sail on one tack isn't too bad but if you want to jibe the sail it gets a bit difficult with the long sheets. Then if you want to douse it in the sock you would need to jibe again to get it on the side that the sock is. For cruising you could drop the whole thing down and reset it on the opposite side. So the whole thing can get a bit cumbersome if you try to get fancy but just getting it set and stay on one tack it's great. I have used it dead downwind by sailing wing and wing. Otherwise 160 degrees apparant is about the limit. I have used it offshore broadreaching in 6-8 knot wind with good success. It is definitely a fun sail to have.

Ron Thompson

Ho'okahiko 97

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: Adventure (IP Logged)
Date: March 26, 2010 07:18AM
Category: Sails and canvas

I don't currently know the measurements of my asymmetric, but as Ron says, it works brilliantly up to about 60 degrees off the wind.
I rig it from a block right at the front of the cranse iron so it's free. I normally climb out to attach the tack line, but plan to detach the tack line from the sail and leave a longer one rigged through the block, and back so it can be handled from the deck.

Mike,
BCC Adventure - Hull #79

[www.facebook.com]

Attachments: Adventure spinnaker.jpg (175kB)  
Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: benjiwoodboat (IP Logged)
Date: March 26, 2010 04:08PM
Category: Sails and canvas

I have a drifter which I hank on. I sheet it back thru the aft most hawsepipe. Of course with it hanked on I can point to weather a bit. There's a couple of nice shots of it here:

[farm4.static.flickr.com]

[farm3.static.flickr.com]


I also find it a bear to tack. I removed the inner stay to help reduce sheet length... But i found it VERY useful on the trip south this pat fall. I never tried it free flying. But for now, I don't mind climbing around on the sprit like a monkey trying to rassle down a jumbo.




--
Ben Eriksen
BCC #91 Elizabeth

Web Design | BCC Elizabeth

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: wfraser (IP Logged)
Date: March 27, 2010 12:28AM
Category: Sails and canvas

Here are two pictures of the bowsprit end of the Japanese-owned BCC Aoelus. It shows a velcro strap encircling the end of bowsprit with what appears to be a shackle wrapped and sewn up in webbing. Attached to the shackle is a block. I saw Aoelus a week ago on show at the Yokohama Boat Show, and noticed this but didn't take a picture of it at the time.

It's what I'm planning to do for the drifter I'll be flying this summer.



Warren Fraser
s/v Voyager of Yokohama

Attachments: bowsprit drifter strop1.jpg (86kB)   bowsprit drifter strop2.jpg (74kB)  
Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: bccodyssey (IP Logged)
Date: March 27, 2010 04:15AM
Category: Sails and canvas

Thanks everyone for the input,
I'm thinking I may just have to join the fun and get another sail to fuss with.
Wayne
BCC Odyssey

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: bccodyssey (IP Logged)
Date: March 31, 2010 05:50PM
Category: Sails and canvas

Hi Ron,
I am still working on getting an asymmetrical. I emailed Elliott-Pattison Sails and was told the dimensions they have used were ave been told were
a luff of 39.9?, leech of 32.75?, and a foot of 25.5? and that the total sail area would be 805 sq feet.
I sent these dimensions to Lee Sails and got the following response:


The sail area based on the current dimensions you gave, would be
416sq/ft.
In our data base we have a drifter listed for your boat, with
Luff = 38.0', Foot = 29.42', and Leech = 31.67', Sail area = 455sq/ft.
The formula given for asymmetrical cruising spinnakers for a
Bristol Channel Cutter is: Luff x Girth x .95625 = sail area.
Girth is calculated by multiplying J x 1.5. Your J, do to the bow sprit
is 17.75, so 17.75 x 1.5 = 26.625 girth.
Therefore: 38.0 x 26.63 x 0.95625 = 967sq/ft????? That is wrong
of course, caused by the bow sprit, making your J 17.75' on a 28' boat.
In my eight years with Lee Sails, I never had an cruising spinnaker
order for a boat with a bow sprit, so I will ask the help from the loft.
The quick and easy way to get the exact info is to ask your friend
Ron for the Lee Sails product number of his spinnaker, located on
a white tag, near the tack of the sail. They can trace that number
and give us the exact dimensions/sail area. Drifter sail areas calculated
like jibs, using Luff, Foot and Leech dimensions, reather then girth.
Assuming the dimensions you just gave me are correct, and the sail area
is 416sq/ft, your radial head spinnaker, made fro 1.5oz Bainbridge ripstop
Nylon would cost $603.00, and the dousing sock $120.00, plus sales tax.
The nylon color samples I mailed you are the ones available.
Later;
Peter

Ron,
Is it possible for you to find the product number so that I can be sure of ordering a sail that matches yours? I assume that providing them with the dimensions you originally posted should create the same sail, but it causes some worry when different sail makers come up with sail areas that vary between 400-800 sq ft.

Thanks,
Wayne
BCC Odyssey

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: Ron Thompson (IP Logged)
Date: March 31, 2010 11:43PM
Category: Sails and canvas

Wayne,

I looked for the number on my sail but it wasn't there and I don't have the receipt or work order. I am sure the specs I gave them are from the BCC sail plan for a "reacher". I assume the sail they made was to those specs although the sail is a "radial head drifter". You can see a picture of my sail in the gallery.

Ron Thompson

Ho'okahiko 97

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: bccodyssey (IP Logged)
Date: April 1, 2010 12:14AM
Category: Sails and canvas

Ron,
Thanks for taking a look for the number.I have seen the picture of your sail and like the size.



Edited 2 times. Last edit at 04/01/10 12:26AM by bccodyssey.

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: bccodyssey (IP Logged)
Date: April 1, 2010 12:14AM
Category: Sails and canvas

Ron and Others,
Maybe the differences in size are not significant, but I now have 3 sets of dimensions.
Ron's--------- -------Elliott-Pattison.s ---------------- Lee Sail Data Base
luff 36'11"------------luff 39.9' ----------------------- luff 38.0'
leach 33'03"----------leach 32.75"-------------------- leach 31.67'
foot 25'08"-----------foot 25.5' -----------------------foot 29.42'

I would be interested in knowing the thoughts on these differences from others who may have more knowledge about this than I do.
Wayne
BCC Odyssey



Edited 8 times. Last edit at 04/01/10 12:27AM by bccodyssey.

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: bccodyssey (IP Logged)
Date: April 8, 2010 10:30PM
Category: Sails and canvas

Ron,
I am hoping you see this. I got the following from the N. Cal Lee Sails rep after I gave him your dimensions which are a 100% match to the sail plan I found in my BCC folder:

The dimensions you gave below, does not add up to 462sq/ft.
If I use the 36.9' luff x 25' girth, using our asymmetrical cruising
spinnaker formula, I come up with 882sq/ft.
If I use the drifter calculation method, I end up with 403sq/ft.
So please try to get your friend Ron's approx. date of order, or
the product number.

Can you give me the approx. date of when you ordered your sail?

Thanks,
Wayne Edney
BCC Odyssey

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: Ron Thompson (IP Logged)
Date: April 9, 2010 04:02AM
Category: Sails and canvas

Wayne,

The 462 sq/ft number comes from the BCC sail plan for a "reacher". Possibly the Sam L. Morse number is not accurate so it is closer to the 400 sq.ft number. The sail was completed on April 15th, 1999 with the invoice number of 25988. I don't see a product number on the invoice or on the sail. I ordered this sail directly with Lee Sails while I was in Hong Kong.

Hope this helps you,

Ron



Edited 1 times. Last edit at 04/09/10 04:07AM by Ron Thompson.

Re: Asymetrical spinnaker or drifter measurements?
Posted by: bccodyssey (IP Logged)
Date: April 9, 2010 11:48PM
Category: Sails and canvas

Ron,
Thanks again. This info has been forwarded to Helen Fung in Hong Kong and should allow them to give me an accurate quote. We have been all over the place with sq footage from 400 to over 1000! And of course the price has moved up and down over 100% depending on the size.
Wayne
BCC Odyssey

Re: Loan approval
Posted by: leilei3915 (IP Logged)
Date: December 29, 2017 03:58PM
Category: Sails and canvas

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